Those agencies that don't accept invoices without POs, but then never produce the POs for the jobs Thread poster: Josep Vives (X)
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Josep Vives (X)
Spain
Local time: 09:39
English to Spanish
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OK so this is a fun post about agencies that tell this lie about not being able to accept an invoice without their PO for a project or job -and we all know that nobody pays an electric bill without a PO-, and their tactic is then to not produce POs for their projects of 10k words in less than 12 hours. How do you deal with this fun (some of you might argue it's actually sad) way of going through life? Do you behave like that in front of your children? Do you feel that's OK? Share your thoughts!
| | | | Lieven Malaise
Belgium
Local time: 09:39
Member (2020)
French to Dutch
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I would never deliver my work for a new client before I have received the PO.
Even for existing and long-standing clients I keep asking for the PO if it takes longer than it should. It's not difficult to issue a PO in, let's say, the first week after the translation request confirmation. Most of the time I receive it immediately after my confirmation, though.
[Edited at 2023-05-23 11:33 GMT]
| | | | | To PO or not to PO, that is the question... | May 23, 2023 |
Typically, I receive a PO when the project is confirmed. For a new client, I will not start translating without some sort of a PO, but for most of my regular clients, I start working on the project as soon as I have a go-ahead (with or without a PO). I've been doing business with them for so long that we know each other well enough and a formal PO isn't required - good old-fashioned trust is all we need: they just send the file, ask if I am available and propose a deadline. Out of my twelve or s... See more Typically, I receive a PO when the project is confirmed. For a new client, I will not start translating without some sort of a PO, but for most of my regular clients, I start working on the project as soon as I have a go-ahead (with or without a PO). I've been doing business with them for so long that we know each other well enough and a formal PO isn't required - good old-fashioned trust is all we need: they just send the file, ask if I am available and propose a deadline. Out of my twelve or so regular clients, 5 agencies send automatically a PO, others only send a job reference number. Only one of my direct clients sends a formal PO. If a client requires a PO number on the invoice and doesn’t send it promptly (ideally with the confirmation) I will stop working with them. ▲ Collapse
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As long as there is a clear agreement in writing about what work I'm supposed to do, by when, and for how much money, I don't care whether there's a formal PO or not.
However, if the client insists on issuing a formal PO, then they should do so before I start working on the job. Otherwise it makes no sense.
I normally submit my invoice at the same time as I deliver the translation and the payment deadline is clearly stated. If the client misses the payment deadli... See more As long as there is a clear agreement in writing about what work I'm supposed to do, by when, and for how much money, I don't care whether there's a formal PO or not.
However, if the client insists on issuing a formal PO, then they should do so before I start working on the job. Otherwise it makes no sense.
I normally submit my invoice at the same time as I deliver the translation and the payment deadline is clearly stated. If the client misses the payment deadline, I'll take whatever action is necessary and I probably won't work with that client again.
For me this seems like standard business practice. In any case, it's not up to the client to dictate my invoicing and payment policies. I set those myself. ▲ Collapse
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Michael Newton 
United States
Local time: 03:39
Japanese to English
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| don't accept invoices | May 24, 2023 |
Never start work without a PO. Not accepting invoices without POs but never producing the POs is a scam.
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 09:39
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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Josep Vives wrote:
This is a fun post about agencies that tell this lie about not being able to accept an invoice without their PO for a project or job ... and their tactic is then to not produce POs for their projects [quick enough].
Based on my experience, agencies that require a PO to be sent alongside the invoice, or require a PO number to be mentioned on the invoice, who are slow to issue such a PO, are usually not doing it maliciously but simply have a very slow or stupid administration system.
You don't know beforehand if an agency is such an agency, but once you discover it, your only option is to aggressively chase the agency each time until they issue the PO number. This can be quite bothersome for the translator, especially if you're used to working with agencies that send their PO numbers without any effort from you.
However, as with all international and internet-based business, this is just part of the job. You can choose to stop working for such agencies or you can continue to work for them and just flag them in your system as a client whose administrative burden is higher.
In larger agencies, some PMs may be slower to respond than others. Sometimes, you can ask a PM's colleague (politely) to look into it.
...and we all know that nobody pays an electric bill without a PO
Using reference numbers on payment requests and invoices is quite normal in the modern world, and it is not unusual if a client's accounting department tells you that they are unable to proceed with your payment unless you provide them with a reference number that they can identify in their system.
I can't pay the electricity bill unless the electricity company puts my electricity account number on the bill. It's true that in this particular scenario it is not **me** who issues that number, but the fact remains that without that number, payment can't proceed.
[Edited at 2023-05-24 07:59 GMT]
| | | | Baran Keki
Türkiye
Local time: 10:39
Member
English to Turkish
| Those PMs that say 'I'll send your PO ASAP' but keep forgetting to send it | May 24, 2023 |
I'm dealing with one of those. It always makes me paranoid thinking if the PO will be calculated based on the matches that I've already entered into the agency's TM during the time she's forgotten to send the PO, and she genuinely forgets (damn it)...
| | | | | Stupid or lucky | May 24, 2023 |
Maybe I'm just stupid, but it seems to me that if you're going to have a purchase order at all, then it has to be issued in advance of the job, because until you, the contractor, accept the purchase order there is no contract, and therefore no legal obligation for the client to pay.
Issuing a PO after the job has been completed makes no sense at all, and it's something I have never encountered.
Maybe I'm just lucky.
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Kay Denney
France
Local time: 09:39
French to English
Baran Keki wrote:
I'm dealing with one of those. It always makes me paranoid thinking if the PO will be calculated based on the matches that I've already entered into the agency's TM during the time she's forgotten to send the PO, and she genuinely forgets (damn it)...
You need to put your foot down, and down tools too. Don't start the job until you get the PO. If you have a deadline of a week, that week starts when you get the PO.
I'm saying that, I don't actually apply this rule. There are some who need a PO number cited on their invoice, but I've been working with them since last century (they were a client of the agency I used to work at, then they pivoted to me once I went freelance). Also, they are a government agency, so they're not going bankrupt either.
With newer clients I will require the PO number, only most of my new clients are small businesses and direct clients who don't have much bureaucracy to get through.
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I have had some cases where the PO was only issued after I had delivered the translation, but these are exceptional cases which are billed by the hour and I only know the hours I spent after completing the job (updates or introduction of changes). Furthermore, this is a direct client with whom I have been working for several years and who always pays promptly...
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The world's second-(?)-largest agency doesn't ever issue POs until you deliver.
But they ask you to do the job in the first place, so that email is a PO in itself.
The PO is then really confirmation of what you can invoice them for.
I do resent this approach to billing but put up with it for reasons I will keep shrouded in mystery.
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