Apr 26, 2023 14:19
1 yr ago
33 viewers *
French term
rond de détente
French to English
Other
Sports / Fitness / Recreation
Property transaction, sale of a large huntin' shootin' fishin' domain and various buildings.
"...
Un hangar abritant :
Installations de découpe du gibier.
Stockage de bois et de matériels.
Une grange.
Un manège olympique construction bois (lamellé-collé) avec tribunes spectateurs et tribunes jury, une carrière, un rond de détente.
Huit abris à chevaux répartis dans les prairies situées autour du corps de ferme et du centre équestre.
..."
To me this looks like some area where horses can trot around in a "relaxed" fashion (or where their riders are relaxed maybe). If there are any horsey people out there, there may well be a specialist horsey term for it. I had a look at a few photos online but nothing jumped out.
"...
Un hangar abritant :
Installations de découpe du gibier.
Stockage de bois et de matériels.
Une grange.
Un manège olympique construction bois (lamellé-collé) avec tribunes spectateurs et tribunes jury, une carrière, un rond de détente.
Huit abris à chevaux répartis dans les prairies situées autour du corps de ferme et du centre équestre.
..."
To me this looks like some area where horses can trot around in a "relaxed" fashion (or where their riders are relaxed maybe). If there are any horsey people out there, there may well be a specialist horsey term for it. I had a look at a few photos online but nothing jumped out.
Proposed translations
(English)
| 3 +1 | round turnout pen |
Bourth
|
| 3 +2 | paddock |
Esther Pugh
|
| 4 | recreation area |
MassimoA
|
| 3 +1 | pre-parade ring |
Althea Draper
|
| 3 | Arena /ring |
ormiston
|
Proposed translations
+1
1 hr
Selected
round turnout pen
I started out thinking this might be the same as a rond de longe, given this reference :
"Montrés dans le rond de détente, tout près des box, ils ont fait courir ceux qui les tenaient en longe "
https://www.ouest-france.fr/normandie/argentan-61200/des-tro...
But on reflection I decided not. Still, it provides a starting point …
A rond de longe seems to be a 'lunge pen' (https://www.markscottarenas.com/equine-arenas/file/construct... though since these are not necessarily circular, 'round pen' might be best.
Then we have 'turnout pens', which I would make 'round turnout pens', assuming the French ronds are necessarily circular.
"What's getting turned out mean? It means that your horse is moved to a pasture or strip of land that allows them the freedom to run, play and get all their energy out. Some horses get turned out more often than others depending on age, health, allergies, and a few other stipulations."
https://ntecdfw.com/horse-riding-blog/turnout-what-are-the-b...
"Turnout is the act of taking a horse from its stall to a dedicated pasture or field. Turning out your horses on a regular basis allows them to maintain their health through exercise, play, and social interaction with other horses."
https://www.thesprucepets.com/importance-of-turnout-for-your...
"The Turnout or mesh pen is a useful tool for horses and other animals where a railed pen is not suitable, and is ideal for mare and foal turnout with the mesh being foal safe. Like our other pens, the Turnout pen is available in any size required and can be made with taller panels or indeed lower panels. The mesh can be at ground level if required."
Note the name of the manufacturer, The Round Pen Company - https://www.round-pen.co.uk/the-turnout-pen/
" Ive got a round turnout pen and for me at the moment it is a complete boon! I bought it a few years ago to turn my (then foals) out in it when the weather was grotty. Since then it has been out ''on loan'' to someone and is now back home being used for my young warmblood who has a tendon injury. We, like you are on clay land and it goes from very boggy to concrete within a matter of hours. My mare is on controlled exercise and was doing 40 mins walking a day and had been box rested since xmas. Since her latest scan my vet has agreed to let her have some restricted turnout and the round pen has been perfect for this. We can move it fairly easily to ensure she has nice grass, it's big enough for her to mooch about in but is unable to pick up any speed and she can still feel like one of the herd. My mare loves it!! And because it is round she can't skid into any corners of it unlike a small fenced off paddock, it encourages her to keep going round the edge of it."
https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/turn-out-pens-you...
"This impeccably maintained facility is complete with a large exterior Olympic-sized dressage ring and round turnout pen, three-stall shed row barn, storage barn with foaling stall, and secure Centaur Fencing."
https://www.chronofhorse.com/classifieds/kilmore-farm/
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Note added at 1 hr (2023-04-26 16:03:10 GMT)
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"pasture = enclosed grassy area, regardless of size
paddock = enclosed dirt/sand area, again regardless of size
pen = small enclosure, usually dirt
field = unenclosed large grassy area"
https://www.horseforum.com/threads/paddock-vs-pasture-vs-pen...
"paddock — a small pasture or enclosure; larger than a pen.
pen — an outdoor enclosure large enough for a horse to walk around in; smaller than a paddock."
https://equisearch.com/all-about-horses/glossary-of-horse-te...
In the US, "A large pen for horses is called a paddock (Eastern US) or a corral (Western US). In some places, an exhibition arena may be called a show pen. A small pen for horses (no more than 15–20 feet on any side) is only known as a pen if it lacks any roof or shelter, otherwise, it is called a stall and is part of a stable."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pen_(enclosure)#:~:text=A larg...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2023-04-26 16:28:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Looking further, the term seems to be used quite loosely, so can probably cover all manner of things. To start with, the rond de détente at a race course can be rather different from that at stables. In the image attached we see a rond de détente at (alongside) a race course (l'Hippodrome de la Bergerie, near le Haras du Pin, Normandy), where the horses are being walked on gravel around a grass oval in the middle of a quadrangle surrounded by stables; whether before or after running, who knows.
"Montrés dans le rond de détente, tout près des box, ils ont fait courir ceux qui les tenaient en longe "
https://www.ouest-france.fr/normandie/argentan-61200/des-tro...
But on reflection I decided not. Still, it provides a starting point …
A rond de longe seems to be a 'lunge pen' (https://www.markscottarenas.com/equine-arenas/file/construct... though since these are not necessarily circular, 'round pen' might be best.
Then we have 'turnout pens', which I would make 'round turnout pens', assuming the French ronds are necessarily circular.
"What's getting turned out mean? It means that your horse is moved to a pasture or strip of land that allows them the freedom to run, play and get all their energy out. Some horses get turned out more often than others depending on age, health, allergies, and a few other stipulations."
https://ntecdfw.com/horse-riding-blog/turnout-what-are-the-b...
"Turnout is the act of taking a horse from its stall to a dedicated pasture or field. Turning out your horses on a regular basis allows them to maintain their health through exercise, play, and social interaction with other horses."
https://www.thesprucepets.com/importance-of-turnout-for-your...
"The Turnout or mesh pen is a useful tool for horses and other animals where a railed pen is not suitable, and is ideal for mare and foal turnout with the mesh being foal safe. Like our other pens, the Turnout pen is available in any size required and can be made with taller panels or indeed lower panels. The mesh can be at ground level if required."
Note the name of the manufacturer, The Round Pen Company - https://www.round-pen.co.uk/the-turnout-pen/
" Ive got a round turnout pen and for me at the moment it is a complete boon! I bought it a few years ago to turn my (then foals) out in it when the weather was grotty. Since then it has been out ''on loan'' to someone and is now back home being used for my young warmblood who has a tendon injury. We, like you are on clay land and it goes from very boggy to concrete within a matter of hours. My mare is on controlled exercise and was doing 40 mins walking a day and had been box rested since xmas. Since her latest scan my vet has agreed to let her have some restricted turnout and the round pen has been perfect for this. We can move it fairly easily to ensure she has nice grass, it's big enough for her to mooch about in but is unable to pick up any speed and she can still feel like one of the herd. My mare loves it!! And because it is round she can't skid into any corners of it unlike a small fenced off paddock, it encourages her to keep going round the edge of it."
https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/turn-out-pens-you...
"This impeccably maintained facility is complete with a large exterior Olympic-sized dressage ring and round turnout pen, three-stall shed row barn, storage barn with foaling stall, and secure Centaur Fencing."
https://www.chronofhorse.com/classifieds/kilmore-farm/
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2023-04-26 16:03:10 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
"pasture = enclosed grassy area, regardless of size
paddock = enclosed dirt/sand area, again regardless of size
pen = small enclosure, usually dirt
field = unenclosed large grassy area"
https://www.horseforum.com/threads/paddock-vs-pasture-vs-pen...
"paddock — a small pasture or enclosure; larger than a pen.
pen — an outdoor enclosure large enough for a horse to walk around in; smaller than a paddock."
https://equisearch.com/all-about-horses/glossary-of-horse-te...
In the US, "A large pen for horses is called a paddock (Eastern US) or a corral (Western US). In some places, an exhibition arena may be called a show pen. A small pen for horses (no more than 15–20 feet on any side) is only known as a pen if it lacks any roof or shelter, otherwise, it is called a stall and is part of a stable."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pen_(enclosure)#:~:text=A larg...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2023-04-26 16:28:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Looking further, the term seems to be used quite loosely, so can probably cover all manner of things. To start with, the rond de détente at a race course can be rather different from that at stables. In the image attached we see a rond de détente at (alongside) a race course (l'Hippodrome de la Bergerie, near le Haras du Pin, Normandy), where the horses are being walked on gravel around a grass oval in the middle of a quadrangle surrounded by stables; whether before or after running, who knows.
Note from asker:
| Thanks. Amazing research as ever. I'll buy that. As I mentioned to Althea, I have a feeling there probably isn't an actual racecourse in this property. |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
philgoddard
3 mins
|
| neutral |
Charles R.
: Je ne pense pas non. La détente, c'est l'échauffement du cheval, elle se fait soit sur un cheval monté, soit à la longe. Les éléments que je trouve pour turnout pen ne correspondent pas./ edit: disag. > neutral (see discussion)
4 hrs
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thanks. "
+2
1 hr
Esther Pugh
United States
United States
United States
ATA certified for English & German
Native in: German 
Works in: English to German, German to English
paddock
Paddocks are fenced areas that are large enough for a horse to move freely but typically not so large that it can run. They are often used to separate horses, limit their movement, or control their diet. In horse racing, a paddock is where racehorses are saddled and paraded before the race.
https://horseracingsense.com/what-are-horse-paddocks-their-u...
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Note added at 1 hr (2023-04-26 15:43:09 GMT)
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There's also the horse "ring", but that's more for walking them, and less for letting them rest or cool down.
https://horseracingsense.com/what-are-horse-paddocks-their-u...
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Note added at 1 hr (2023-04-26 15:43:09 GMT)
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There's also the horse "ring", but that's more for walking them, and less for letting them rest or cool down.
Note from asker:
| Funnily enough the word "paddock" was the first thing that came to mind. But I'm slightly dubious if only because "rond" strongly suggests horses going round in a ring. OTOH it might be that "rond" is a faux ami in this expression... |
| Both in the archives here and in my offline Eng-Fr dictionary I find "paddock" and "enclos" suggested as translations for "paddock". Which isn't to say your translation isn't right. Might need a bit more proof possibly... |
2 hrs
recreation area
For me it is like a relaxation area. It refers to the spectators, not the horses.
+1
2 hrs
Althea Draper
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Native in English
Specializes in field
United Kingdom
Freelance Medical Translator, MA (Hons)
Native in: English (Variants: British, Scottish) 
Works in: French to English, Spanish to English, English
pre-parade ring
A video from the Hippodrome de Longchamp in Paris showing the sign for the rond de détente in French and English where it is called the pre-parade ring.
https://twitter.com/francegalop/status/1547643166974623745?c...
Photos of a rond de détente
https://www.france-sire.com/article-ventes_et_shows-37086-sa... (just past ~ three quarters of the way down the page)
https://www.france-sire.com/article-actualites-16628-a_la_de... (just before half way down the page)
This is a link to information about the Hippodrome de Vincennes where it states, "Le rond de détente : Il est disposé au milieu des écuries, en contre-bas, et permet aux chevaux de marcher au calme."
https://www.iddeuxpoints.com/pro/Brochure_Grand_Prix_d_Ameri...
From the Jockey Club's website
"WHEN ARE HORSES LED INTO THE PRE-PARADE RING?
Racehorses will usually be walked into the pre-parade ring around half an hour before each race is due to begin, so they can be led around by their grooms to get their muscles moving and their blood flowing. They will be saddled whilst they are there. Afterwards, they’ll be led to the Parade Ring so racegoers can see them all in one place."
https://www.thejockeyclub.co.uk/the-racing/racing-explained/...
From Racing Post explaining the difference between the paddock/parade ring (cercle de parade (ou rond)) and the pre-parade ring -
"The pre-parade ring and paddock
Often referred to as the parade ring, the horse paddock is where the runners in the forthcoming race are paraded for racegoers to get a proper look at them. The parade also gets the horses moving and relaxed.
The horses do not start in the parade ring, though, as after being transported to the track and checked over, most horses go through the pre-parade ring first. This is situated closer to the stables and the horses are not kitted out yet with racing equipment such as their saddle. The horses are led around by their grooms, with the process designed to help them stay warm and focused. Racegoers can get an early look at the horses without saddling equipment to assess their raceday demeanour and fitness."
https://www.racingpost.com/guide-to-racing/the-paddock-and-s...
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Note added at 3 hrs (2023-04-26 17:48:00 GMT)
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As Mpoma has pointed out it's not related to racing. If it's more to do with show jumping/eventing, then it's more likely to be a warm-up arena or ring. This event has a "Carrière de détente (warm-up arena)" (page 17 of 26)
https://www.event-pau.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/Avant-p...
It's also called a collecting ring
https://harryhall.com/blog/post/10-things-you-need-to-know-a...
https://twitter.com/francegalop/status/1547643166974623745?c...
Photos of a rond de détente
https://www.france-sire.com/article-ventes_et_shows-37086-sa... (just past ~ three quarters of the way down the page)
https://www.france-sire.com/article-actualites-16628-a_la_de... (just before half way down the page)
This is a link to information about the Hippodrome de Vincennes where it states, "Le rond de détente : Il est disposé au milieu des écuries, en contre-bas, et permet aux chevaux de marcher au calme."
https://www.iddeuxpoints.com/pro/Brochure_Grand_Prix_d_Ameri...
From the Jockey Club's website
"WHEN ARE HORSES LED INTO THE PRE-PARADE RING?
Racehorses will usually be walked into the pre-parade ring around half an hour before each race is due to begin, so they can be led around by their grooms to get their muscles moving and their blood flowing. They will be saddled whilst they are there. Afterwards, they’ll be led to the Parade Ring so racegoers can see them all in one place."
https://www.thejockeyclub.co.uk/the-racing/racing-explained/...
From Racing Post explaining the difference between the paddock/parade ring (cercle de parade (ou rond)) and the pre-parade ring -
"The pre-parade ring and paddock
Often referred to as the parade ring, the horse paddock is where the runners in the forthcoming race are paraded for racegoers to get a proper look at them. The parade also gets the horses moving and relaxed.
The horses do not start in the parade ring, though, as after being transported to the track and checked over, most horses go through the pre-parade ring first. This is situated closer to the stables and the horses are not kitted out yet with racing equipment such as their saddle. The horses are led around by their grooms, with the process designed to help them stay warm and focused. Racegoers can get an early look at the horses without saddling equipment to assess their raceday demeanour and fitness."
https://www.racingpost.com/guide-to-racing/the-paddock-and-s...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2023-04-26 17:48:00 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
As Mpoma has pointed out it's not related to racing. If it's more to do with show jumping/eventing, then it's more likely to be a warm-up arena or ring. This event has a "Carrière de détente (warm-up arena)" (page 17 of 26)
https://www.event-pau.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/Avant-p...
It's also called a collecting ring
https://harryhall.com/blog/post/10-things-you-need-to-know-a...
Note from asker:
| Thanks for your usual amazing research. No reason you should know this, but I have a feeling this estate is not actually a racecourse. |
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Bourth
: While I was coming to the conclusion that it COULD be this, it ain't necessarily so. See its used here, where no pre-race parading is necessary: https://www.ecuriegourdain.com/fr/infrastructures-le-meilleu...
9 mins
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Thanks, you're right - I've added a note above. If it's more for eventing/showjumping it could be a warm-up ring/collecting ring.
|
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| agree |
Daryo
6 hrs
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Thanks Daryo
|
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| agree |
ormiston
14 hrs
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Thanks ormiston
|
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| disagree |
Charles R.
: I'm pretty sure it's neither related to racing, nor to competition. In jumping or dressage competition, it would be called a "carrière/paddock de détente". / Please refer to the discussion box.
1 day 12 hrs
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"Un manège olympique construction bois (lamellé-collé) avec tribunes spectateurs et tribunes jury, une carrière, un rond de détente". Wouldn't that imply that it was associated with the manège olympique?
|
3 days 1 hr
Arena /ring
a bit late, but working from what it is used for I get this (simple solution):
"What is a horse play area called?
... Most often, the place where you ride a horse is called an “arena” or a “ring.” These facilities can be indoors or outdoors, depending on your location and the type of activity...
"What is a horse play area called?
... Most often, the place where you ride a horse is called an “arena” or a “ring.” These facilities can be indoors or outdoors, depending on your location and the type of activity...
Discussion
Il y a peu de hits, l'expression est peu courante et elle est utilisée essentiellement dans le domaine des courses hippiques où elle désigne quelque chose de complètement différent d'après ce que je comprends. En ce qui concerne les centres équestres, cette photo correspond à l'idée (en plus petit et avec un sol peu adapté) que je me fais d'un rond de détente, un enclos beaucoup trop petit pour accueillir les chevaux et cavaliers pour la détente (l'échauffement) pendant une compétition. Et même s'il faisait 20 mètres de diamètre, ça serait encore beaucoup trop petit.
Ceci étant dit, il ne s'agit pas d'un terme consacré, universel et il est aussi possible que dans le cas du texte de Mpoma, le terme désigne un enclos beaucoup plus grand. Je n'ai pas de certitude, juste un sentiment.
Les centres équestres sont également souvent le lieu de compétitions (pas tous mais les plus grands qui sont équipés correctement). Cela ne signifie pas que tous leurs équipements sont dédiés à la compétition. Par exemple, dans celui où je montais, il y avait chaque année la compétition d'ouverture de la saison en saut d'obstacles. Le centre avait plusieurs ronds de longe mais aucun n'était utilisé pendant les compétitions car c'est beaucoup trop étroit pour détendre un cheval pendant une compétition. Il faut de la place pour les obstacles en CSO et beaucoup plus de place que dans un rond pour les compétitions de dressage. C'est donc la petite carrière qui était désignée comme "carrière de détente" (warm-up arena / ring / area).
I only rode (more like took a ride with them not sure if they noticed i was there) draught horses (i think that's what they called), thanks to a farmer, mainly Boulonnais in my region, and once a Percheron and a Friesian those were good memories, impressive beasts.
Anyway i'm disgressing, @Charles, thanks for the info.
On the subject of équitation, a couple of years ago I was staying with a friend in Maisons Laffitte (very horsey suburb of Paris)... and his stepson was talking about what he was doing that afternoon: he's a teenager and talks very fast, and he kept saying "liquidation"... but in fact it turned out he was saying "l'équitation". My friend said that "liquidation" is about right, i.e. given the cost of pursuing that hobby in Maisons Laffitte.
See "Dimensions et profils par discipline" https://equipedia.ifce.fr/infrastructure-et-equipement/insta...
Ah well then! I was just interested to know, that kind of way. My niece used to do a lot of horse-riding.
Nice one Charles.
Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Apologies.
"Most riders are familiar with the fact that an “Olympic size” dressage arena is 20m wide and 60m long;" Of course this doesn't say anything about it being indoors. But neither does manège olympique necessarily, although photos of the French expression tend to show something with a roof at least, and crucially the same dimensions. Maybe I'll go for "covered Olympic size dressage arena". Maybe not.
Interesting...after further digging, the respective Wiki pages involved are headed "manège" and "riding hall". Maybe the safe bet would be to leave out school, unless you have information to the contrary?
There's something sparking in my head telling me that Olympic implies an oval-shaped track, but these halls are not oval. Also there's no sign of a connected Olympic event.
"Riding hall" is probably better than "riding school". Or maybe "Olympic riding arena". Or even (after googling) "Olympic dressage arena". Anyway, something along those lines...
With the olympic size riding hall and other things from your context, that seems to be an impressive estate.
I looked around with infrastructures associated with round pens/show rings/parade rings/ lunging rings and context it's the closest term i could find (relaxation circle/area), like Phil suggested, don't know if there is a more official name for it, some colleagues might be more efficient.
For example:
LE NOUVEAU LONGCHAMP (Dossier de presse)
(p.4 un rond de détente [...] / a relaxation circle [...])
https://www.perraultarchitecture.com/data/media_24097/fiche/...
https://www.perraultarchitecture.com/data/media_24097/fiche/...
Examples:
///
"Relaxation area": ... I've a vision now of an urbane horse in a straw hat, reposing in a large deck chair, fag in one hand, bottle of beer in the other...