Glossary entry (derived from question below)
English term or phrase:
The complainant is the owner-among others-of the following trademarks.
Chinese translation:
别的商标姑且不提,投诉方确为以下商标的拥有者。
Added to glossary by
hongsang
Apr 21, 2007 02:39
17 yrs ago
English term
among others
English to Chinese
Law/Patents
Law (general)
trademark
The Complainant is the owner –among others- of the following trademarks.
在这里要怎样理解among others呢? 是不是说投诉方是以下商标的唯一拥有者呢?
请指教。谢谢。
在这里要怎样理解among others呢? 是不是说投诉方是以下商标的唯一拥有者呢?
请指教。谢谢。
Proposed translations
(Chinese)
3 +2 | (除此之外) 至少 | Wenjer Leuschel (X) |
4 +6 | 别的姑且不论 | Linguist Laureate |
3 +4 | 之一 | Forrest Liang |
4 +1 | FYI - I agree with Forrest Liang | Philip Tang |
4 +1 | 尤其 | Julia Zou |
4 | FYI | karcsy |
3 | 中 | hewhew |
Proposed translations
+2
7 mins
Selected
(除此之外) 至少
那個人除了下列商標的擁有人之外,可能還擁有別的商標,但至少他擁有下列商標。
Note from asker:
我觉得Wenjer Leuschel 这个解释比较合理。the owner-among others-of the following trademarks可能是法律上的固定说法,不能从语法结构上去分析。Sage Song "姑不论其它,首先是以下商标的所有者”的翻译简洁,但我觉得这个中文翻译看了后,人们还是会问“姑不论其它什么呢?” 还是模能两可。 |
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
Ozethai
: What happens to semantic collocation?
8 hrs
|
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1880210 One of the answers is a non-native.
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agree |
Julia Zou
21 hrs
|
Thanks. 我觉得 Sage Song 的“姑不论其它”最好。
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neutral |
hewhew
: I don't read the context but as the term complainant indicates I am somewhat sure that the complainant, as one of owners, brings a lawsuit or administrative proceeding against trademark infringer but in second sense other owners remain indifferent
1 day 1 hr
|
Could you explain why "the" owner of the following trademarks?
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agree |
Danbing HE
3 days 21 hrs
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thanks a lot, Wenjer Leuschel. Thank you for your explanation, your deep research and your time. You are a very serious translator. I learned a lot from you. "
+4
35 mins
之一
是以下商标的拥有人(之一)。
我认为“among others”修饰的是“the owner ”。
我认为“among others”修饰的是“the owner ”。
Note from asker:
我觉得这个理解不正确。如果是这样的话,至少应该是“an owner"。 |
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Philip Tang
1 hr
|
Thank you, Commuease!
|
|
agree |
hewhew
: right
1 hr
|
Thank you, hewhew!
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agree |
H. J. Zhang
: among other/all owners
2 hrs
|
Thank you, John!
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agree |
Guei Lin
2 hrs
|
Thank you, Guei Lin!
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agree |
Lily Zhang
5 hrs
|
Thank you, Lily!
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agree |
Ozethai
8 hrs
|
Thank you, Ozethai!
|
|
disagree |
Wenjer Leuschel (X)
: No, it isn't the case. http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1880210
20 hrs
|
Thank you for your information, Wenjer!
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|
disagree |
jyuan_us
: The origial means sth else.
1 day 4 hrs
|
谢谢评议!我并不否认Sage Song和Huijun Suo的答案,它们也是有可能的。但我仍觉得我所列的这种可能在这里概率较大。
|
+6
1 hr
别的姑且不论
别的姑且不论,首先是以下商标的所有者。
Note from asker:
这个翻译好像留给人太多揣测了。 |
再三思量,觉得 Huijun Suo的解释很有道理。 |
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Huijun Suo
: among others 是对“身份”的说明,即原告对于下列商标可能还具有除所有者之外的其他身份,如使用者,授权人,领权人,代理人等,只不过这些可能与本案无关,所以不一一列举。
2 hrs
|
thanks!
|
|
agree |
jyuan_us
: 这个比较逻辑。
14 hrs
|
thanks
|
|
agree |
Wenjer Leuschel (X)
: Correct! 别的不用说,我原本也是这个意思。 http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1880210
19 hrs
|
thanks
|
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agree |
Shaunna (X)
: 同意。和Huijun一样的想法。而且,如果是说他是拥有者之一,一定不会用“... is THE owner...”,而是会用 is ONE/AN owner...
21 hrs
|
thanks!
|
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agree |
Zhoudan
21 hrs
|
thanks!
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agree |
ysun
: “among others” = “among other facts”. It is a FACT that “The Complainant is the owner of the following trademarks.”
1 day 2 hrs
|
neutral |
hewhew
: 原告具有其它身份,这不符合逻辑, 商标所有人不可能成为自己的代理人, 代理人是代理委托人实施代理事项,委托人不可能委托自己代理自己的事务. 成为领权人? 这应该是台湾的说法吧,大陆应该是被许可人,就是获得商标所有人的许可,从而能够使用商标的人,所有人有必要许可自己使用自己合法所有的商标吗? 商标所有者当然可以自己使用,也可以许可他人使用,在这样的情况下,他可以成为许可人,既授权人, 但是文中这样表达有必要吗,
1 day 4 hrs
|
+1
2 hrs
FYI - I agree with Forrest Liang
是不是说投诉方是以下商标的唯一拥有者呢? NO!
I agree with Forrest Liang, “among others” is a prepositional phrase modifying the OWNER;
Take away the – among others – you have a perfectly clear sentence -
“The complainant is the owner of the following trademarks.
However, if the complainant is not the sole owner of all that trademarks, then
He is the owner, (among other owners) (along with many other owners), of the following trademarks.
Looking from a different perspective:
“AMONG OTHERS” modifies “TRADEMARKS” most unlikely -
if the “among others” meant to modify “trademarks”, it should be placed after “trademarks” (always put the modifier next to the term to be modified).
But I don’t think so – if other trademarks are not important enough to be listed, it’s not worth the effort to be mentioned (with a modifier).
Plus, even the writer thinks it’s necessary to use a modifier to indicate an “incomplete list (of trademarks), then
“…..trademarks, plus many others” would be clearer and logical than
“…..trademarks, among others.
I agree with Forrest Liang, “among others” is a prepositional phrase modifying the OWNER;
Take away the – among others – you have a perfectly clear sentence -
“The complainant is the owner of the following trademarks.
However, if the complainant is not the sole owner of all that trademarks, then
He is the owner, (among other owners) (along with many other owners), of the following trademarks.
Looking from a different perspective:
“AMONG OTHERS” modifies “TRADEMARKS” most unlikely -
if the “among others” meant to modify “trademarks”, it should be placed after “trademarks” (always put the modifier next to the term to be modified).
But I don’t think so – if other trademarks are not important enough to be listed, it’s not worth the effort to be mentioned (with a modifier).
Plus, even the writer thinks it’s necessary to use a modifier to indicate an “incomplete list (of trademarks), then
“…..trademarks, plus many others” would be clearer and logical than
“…..trademarks, among others.
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Forrest Liang
: 谢谢你的支持和详尽分析!
13 mins
|
My pleaure!
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agree |
Ozethai
6 hrs
|
Thank you, Ozethai!
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disagree |
Wenjer Leuschel (X)
: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1880210
18 hrs
|
Have read your ref. site, some come close to my opion, others different. I will keep my opinion; grammar rules!
|
+1
5 mins
尤其
The Complainant is the owner –among others- of the following trademarks
是所有者,尤其是以下商标的所有者。
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Note added at 9 mins (2007-04-21 02:48:10 GMT)
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eg.
尤其,其中(=among others). Among other things he was interested in collecting old coins. 他尤其对收集古钱币特别感兴趣。 Among other things hissing is considered rather rude. 诸多行为中,尤以发嘘声被认为是非常不礼貌的行为。 ↘今日一句 ...
psweb.swufe.edu.cn/~eco2002/xuexi.htm - 2k - 补充材料 - 网页快照 - 类似网页
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Note added at 17 mins (2007-04-21 02:56:15 GMT)
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更正一下:原告/投诉者尤其为以下商标的所有者
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Note added at 10 hrs (2007-04-21 13:32:38 GMT)
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会不会是说原告除了是下面这些商标的所有着,还有可能是其它商标的所有者呢?
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Note added at 1 day34 mins (2007-04-22 03:13:39 GMT)
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我还是觉得这里是要强调原告是以下商标的所有者。
原告尤其拥有以下商标:
这样翻译如何?好像比”原告尤其拥有以下商标“好一些。
是所有者,尤其是以下商标的所有者。
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 mins (2007-04-21 02:48:10 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
eg.
尤其,其中(=among others). Among other things he was interested in collecting old coins. 他尤其对收集古钱币特别感兴趣。 Among other things hissing is considered rather rude. 诸多行为中,尤以发嘘声被认为是非常不礼貌的行为。 ↘今日一句 ...
psweb.swufe.edu.cn/~eco2002/xuexi.htm - 2k - 补充材料 - 网页快照 - 类似网页
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 17 mins (2007-04-21 02:56:15 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
更正一下:原告/投诉者尤其为以下商标的所有者
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 10 hrs (2007-04-21 13:32:38 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
会不会是说原告除了是下面这些商标的所有着,还有可能是其它商标的所有者呢?
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day34 mins (2007-04-22 03:13:39 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
我还是觉得这里是要强调原告是以下商标的所有者。
原告尤其拥有以下商标:
这样翻译如何?好像比”原告尤其拥有以下商标“好一些。
Note from asker:
我一开始觉得这个翻译有照搬中文现有翻译之嫌,不适合用在这里。后来我反复琢磨among的英文解释之一“in addition to...",想到既然是“in addition to other things"," 除了其它的”,又不明确指出其它的东西,那就是说指出来的东西更重要,这样翻成“尤其”也就挺合适的了。但仅是翻成“尤其”,句子的含义还是不够清楚。 |
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
Ozethai
: 字词的意思是翻对了,但字词的位置在这特别重要。通常不应该这么了解的。
9 hrs
|
Thank you for your advice, Ozethai!
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agree |
Wenjer Leuschel (X)
: 也可以这么说。 http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1880210
21 hrs
|
谢谢Wenjer! 真是个好办法!
|
2 hrs
中
这个商标可能是共有商标或者集体商标,在这样的情况下,商标所有人不止一人.
可以翻译成: 投诉人是下列商标所有人中的一人.
供参考
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Note added at 1 day2 hrs (2007-04-22 04:49:32 GMT)
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Could you explain why "the" owner of the following trademarks?
____________________________________________________
I cannot add my explanation there. i don't understand what is to be clarified, the phrase, "among others" can be used to modify owner or trademark, but as can be seen from where it is located, namely in a place immediately following the owner, it is obvious that it is meant to modify the owner.
what is the phrase, "the following trademarks" meant to express here. I am not sure since i have not read the context, but it is possible that all of the trademarks would be those against which the infringement is targeted.
可以翻译成: 投诉人是下列商标所有人中的一人.
供参考
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day2 hrs (2007-04-22 04:49:32 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Could you explain why "the" owner of the following trademarks?
____________________________________________________
I cannot add my explanation there. i don't understand what is to be clarified, the phrase, "among others" can be used to modify owner or trademark, but as can be seen from where it is located, namely in a place immediately following the owner, it is obvious that it is meant to modify the owner.
what is the phrase, "the following trademarks" meant to express here. I am not sure since i have not read the context, but it is possible that all of the trademarks would be those against which the infringement is targeted.
Note from asker:
这个说法和Forrest Liang是一样的。我觉得不妥。 |
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Ozethai
6 hrs
|
disagree |
Wenjer Leuschel (X)
: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1880210
18 hrs
|
1 day 20 hrs
FYI
It means to say the owner owns other things aside from
'the following trademarks'.
I came up with this conclusion because I dissected the sentence --- diagramming.
The complainant is the owner - among others - of the following trademarks.
The complanant is the owner & the owner is the complainant.
'among others' & 'owner of the following trademarks' both describes the owner.
'among others' is delineated with hyphens, meaning it is non-essential to the whole sentence, it just give additional information about the 'owner'
'among others' does not describe the 'trademarks', beside it doesn't make sence to say --- owner of thr following trademaks among other [trademarks], plus the fact it said 'following trademarks', the owner already owns a lot of trademarks.
I can't type Chinese character with computer that I am using right now, I'll use PINYIN, hope it makes sense to you.
yuan gao chu le yong you xia le shang biao de suo you chuan zhi wai, ta hai yong you qi ta chan ye.
'the following trademarks'.
I came up with this conclusion because I dissected the sentence --- diagramming.
The complainant is the owner - among others - of the following trademarks.
The complanant is the owner & the owner is the complainant.
'among others' & 'owner of the following trademarks' both describes the owner.
'among others' is delineated with hyphens, meaning it is non-essential to the whole sentence, it just give additional information about the 'owner'
'among others' does not describe the 'trademarks', beside it doesn't make sence to say --- owner of thr following trademaks among other [trademarks], plus the fact it said 'following trademarks', the owner already owns a lot of trademarks.
I can't type Chinese character with computer that I am using right now, I'll use PINYIN, hope it makes sense to you.
yuan gao chu le yong you xia le shang biao de suo you chuan zhi wai, ta hai yong you qi ta chan ye.
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
Huijun Suo
: Another interesting suggestion! I type the Chinese for you: 原告除了拥有下列商标的所有权之外,他/她还拥有其他产业。
19 hrs
|
Thanks for your help!
|
Discussion
Cette phrase ne signifie certainement pas qu’il existe d’autres personnes titulaires de ces marques".
It means "This sentence means in general that the complainant is the owner of several trademarks among which are the following ones:
This sentence certainly doesn't means that there are other persons who own these trademarks".
So now everything is clear. Wenjer Leuschel's explanation is totally correct. Sage Song's wording is the best. So I combine both to get the final translation as "姑且不提其它的商标,投诉方确为以下商标的拥有者。”
Thanks a lot to everybody. I am so happy that I got so much help here. Case closed! Cheers!
4. Factual Background
The Complainant is a worldwide leading retail group, created ... by Gérard Mulliez. In 1981, ... Today, ...
The Complainant is - among others - owner of the following registered trademarks:
请注意句子结构!
3. Factual Background
The Complainant is the owner, among others, of the registered trademarks 'XXX' and 'YYY' in A and in B, used in association especially with ABCD services.
The Complainant uses also the mark 'XYX' in ....
当然,HuijunShuo 的理解“among others 是对“身份”的说明。。。。。。”也可以成立,但这需要更多上下文才能确定。
是以下商标的拥有人(之一)。
我们求证的不是谁强谁弱的问题,我怎么看,Sage Song 的那个说法最恰当,虽然后面的“首先”应该拿掉。
Among other things hissing is considered rather rude. 隐含的意思是“除了嘘声之外,还有别的被认为是非常不礼貌的行为。”
因此,我说你翻译成“尤其”也可以。
试译:
原告尤其拥有以下商标: