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La bave du crapaud n'atteint pas la blanche colombe

Glossary entry

French term or phrase:

entre deux eaux

English translation:

suspended between two elements

Added to glossary by Jane F
May 23, 2016 10:10
7 yrs ago
7 viewers *
French term

entre deux eaux

French to English Art/Literary General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters
L’ambiance toujours poussiéreuse, entre deux mondes, entre deux eaux, comme apparait Setsuko Klossowska de Rola, flottant à la manière de l’Ophelia de John Everett Millais.

On the work of a photographer.
Proposed translations (English)
3 +3 suspended between two elements
4 +3 somewhere in between
3 +2 ethereal
3 +1 otherworldly / whimsical
3 +1 between this world and the underworld
4 (ethereal,) liminal
3 between two waters
2 half-submerged
2 in the twilight zone
2 -1 between two oceans
Change log

May 27, 2016 13:55: Jane F Created KOG entry

Discussion

Laurette Tassin (asker) May 25, 2016:
Finally got the image, cannot share unfortunately, but ethereal, otherworldly, suspension etc. fit. what I see has more to do with clouds than dust or even water actually so thanks so much all for your time and suggestions.

How to I grade??? Have to split it!
Laurette Tassin (asker) May 25, 2016:
@ Phillipa Thanks !!!! Mood ! Yes.
Setsuko (it is easy to find on net) is Balthus's wife, the video is about her husband's studio left as is after his death: from dust to dust. But this is just one sentence in the text I'm translating.... so I'd better get back to it. Cheers all!
Philippa Smith May 25, 2016:
@Laurette I think you need to go a bit further from the French. You could try something like 'The mood the work conjures up is misty, ethereal, a world suspended between two elements, just like...'
Laurette Tassin (asker) May 25, 2016:
@ TM haven't access to the film, ok replace décor by setting (which is actually what I had decided on ) or scene. The photographs are also dimly lit, ghostly, the faces warped. I even thought of eerie instead of 'dusty' (which I really don't like) ... in poussièreuse, there is the notion of time ... that eludes me
Tony M May 25, 2016:
@ Asker I think you really need to see the video in question before you can write about it at this sort of level!
We don't use 'décor' in this way in EN, it is usually only used to refer to the 'décoration' in a building etc., but NOT for a 'scene' or 'setting' in anything like a theatrical or cinema context. So it could be wildly inappropriate here...

And as for 'powdery', that hardly seems an adjective that can be applied in EN to a setting (unless it is a snow scene or a flour mill!) — why do you want to change 'poussiéreuse' into 'poudreuse'? Again, without seeing it, it's impossible to know just
how literally this can be interpreted...
Laurette Tassin (asker) May 25, 2016:
So it turns out the sentence describes a video. I am risking another proposal:

The décor is as always powdery, otherworldly and afloat as Setsuko Klossowska de Rola appears to be, drifting like John Everett Millais’s Ophelia.

Does not seem possible to keep the between- between.

Thank you all. the discussion helps. I would love to share points around, but it doesn't seem possible.
Jane F May 24, 2016:
@Philippa Thanks, I've just posted it!
Philippa Smith May 24, 2016:
@Jane F Jane you should post your suggestion. There are some other good ideas, but I like yours the best!
Clair Pickworth May 24, 2016:
suspended/floating/caught between two worlds a hazy (rather than clouded) atmosphere? Which you may be able to tie in with the ethereal/dreamlike suggestion below
barely submerged/suspended/floating (in a watery realm somewhere between two worlds - stretching it somewhat?)
on the verge/threshold/brink
Just a few suggestions for you to play around with!
Laurette Tassin (asker) May 23, 2016:
@ TonyM well scrap that idea then! catch u all later, night!
ormiston May 23, 2016:
alison Should post a suggestion!
Tony M May 23, 2016:
@ Asker Doesn't really sound terribly natural or idiomatic to me in EN, I'm afraid.

Why have you taken 'poussiéreuse' towards 'clouded'? I see it more along the lines of 'misty', or maybe the idea of dust particles dancing in a shaft of sunlight? Nor do I quite see why you have opted for 'consistently' — consistent compared with what?

The construction using 'there floats...' feels rather awkward to me here; I don't see why you can't just say 'floats Setsuko', or possibly avoid the reversal altogether...

And to me, mid-water sounds to me more like half-way between the surface of the water and the bottom, like at 'mid-depth'; 'mid-water' just sounds odd and awkward to me.

Of course, it would help if we knew what was being described here — is it a specific picture? If so, is it available on line?
Laurette Tassin (asker) May 23, 2016:
Thanks @ Tony M and all for your help. I am leaning toward something like:
...in a consistently clouded atmosphere, there floats Setsuko as if between worlds, mid-water, like John Everett Millais' Ophélia
Tony M May 23, 2016:
@ Asker Note that there is a rather dated EN expression that equates to this, though the underlying meaning isn't really quite the same (more literal than figurative): " 'Twixt wind and water"
However, I don't think for one moment that would be appropriate to try and shoehorn into your current context!
Alison MacG May 23, 2016:
floating between two planes Could you do something with this?
http://www.goodnight35.co/asp_scripts/print_image.asp?Websit...
Similarly, in Ben Timpson’s artwork “Ophelia”, Ophelia floats between two planes: the surface and the bottom. In this scene, she has rejected continuing to live, turning her face away from the light at the surface. However, she is looking off to the side rather than to the bottom, almost as if she wishes there was some middle ground between the suffering of life and the uncertainty of death. In this moment of hovering between the two planes, she seems to secondguess her de[s]cision and reconsider the advantages of each extreme.
https://timpsonwiki.wikispaces.com/Ophelia?responseToken=0f2...
ormiston May 23, 2016:
I really like Your 'suspended'
Jane F May 23, 2016:
How about something like 'suspended between two worlds and two elements'?
Laurette Tassin (asker) May 23, 2016:
Thank you for your input Louisa, the idea is that the subject photographed seems to be floating (like Ophelia) just under the surface of the water. but to echo 'entre deux mondes' does anything come to mind...

Proposed translations

+3
1 day 45 mins
Selected

suspended between two elements

Encouraged by Philippa's kind remark in the discussion box I'm posting this as an answer!
Peer comment(s):
agree Philippa Smith : Perfect!
25 mins
agree ormiston
28 mins
agree Victoria Britten
5 hrs
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "thank you!"
-1
8 mins

between two oceans

I'm guessing that this person travels frequently between two continents.
I don't really like the sound of "between two oceans" though, something less literal would probabaly work better here.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 10 mins (2016-05-23 10:20:45 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Ah between Switzerland and Japan
Peer comment(s):
disagree Tony M : 'entre deux eaux' is a set expression with the basic meaning of 'just below the surface', which fits with the mention of Ophelia.
3 mins
Wow, I'm completely à coté de la plaque here :) thanks!
Something went wrong...
17 mins

between two waters

It seems to me that the litteral English equivalent can be used in a metaphorical sense as well - "between two worlds, between two waters". To be confirmed by a native English speaker!
Something went wrong...
+1
41 mins

otherworldly / whimsical

Both words sprang to mind when reading your context and thinking of the painting...with a little poetic licence!
Peer comment(s):
agree Clair Pickworth
19 hrs
Something went wrong...
1 hr

half-submerged

Half-submerged definition, under the surface of water or any other enveloping medium
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/half-submerged
Peer comment(s):
neutral ormiston : am not too keen on this as a qualifier of 'ambiance'
5 mins
Something went wrong...
+3
1 hr

somewhere in between

Peer comment(s):
agree philgoddard : Yours is the only answer with a reference!
1 hr
agree Clair Pickworth
18 hrs
neutral Carol Gullidge : commenting ONLY on the Reference: some of those entries are great whilst others are decidedly dodgy!
21 hrs
neutral SafeTex : I have proposed an answer so I will refrain from a disagree, but I would like to know how the suggestion would fit in with the rest. "Between two worlds, somewhere in between"???
1 day 26 mins
agree Philippe Barré
1 day 8 hrs
Something went wrong...
+2
1 hr

ethereal

or "floaty" or "floating", as she describes her own life as rather "floating" (as well as "ethereal"). However, you would then need to avoid translating "flottant" from the following sentence, but this could be achieved without too much difficulty and with no translation loss.
Peer comment(s):
agree Delina Alwanger
21 mins
thanks Delina!
agree Clair Pickworth
17 hrs
thanks Clair! And, like you, I would have used "hazy', but "background"(probably) rather than "atmosphere" as this is about photographs
Something went wrong...
+1
3 hrs

between this world and the underworld

suggestion
Example sentence:

Ophelia in the Underworld

Reference:

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/9124208/1/Ophelia-in-the-Underworld

Peer comment(s):
agree Yolanda Broad
8 hrs
Thank you Yolanda !
neutral ormiston : not convinced about a reference to the underworld here
21 hrs
how about "half way between this world and the underworld" ?
neutral writeaway : also not sure about the refernce to the underworld. has sinister connotations. is that apparent in the original?
23 hrs
Something went wrong...
7 hrs

in the twilight zone

may work here for this expression or the one before (entre deux mondes)
Something went wrong...
1123 days
French term (edited): (entre deux mondes,) entre deux eaux

(ethereal,) liminal

I think an attempt should be made to convey the two expressions "entre deux mondes" and "entre deux eaux" and, if possible, to do it in such a way that their phrasing is related. Not easy.

"Entre deux mondes" means "neither one reality nor another"
"Entre deux eaux", in the non-figurative sense, means "affected by competing currents", but it can also mean "sitting on the fence"

My suggestion for the whole phrase is "entre deux mondes, entre deux eaux" is "ethereal, liminal" ... The French has a poetic resonance between the two expressions; the assonance in the English hopefully conveys some sort of similar poetic, emotional power.
Something went wrong...
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