| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14] > | Please remove ChatGPT option from KudoZ (Staff: removed) Thread poster: ibz
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Lieven Malaise
Belgium
Local time: 02:28
Member (2020)
French to Dutch
+ ...
Philip Lees wrote:
What you're saying is essentially that good writing is going to become obsolete.
I still see no reason to believe that, despite the rise of the machines. Let's take the example of website translation. Before AI and MT you had well translated websites and terribly translated websites. Nowadays you still have well translated websites and the terribly translated websites might be less terribly translated thanks to AI. However, bottom line remains that despite all that there's still a demand for quality translations and I don't see why that would change, unless the machines start to translate like (the better) humans can.
The use of 'well-enough' language will indeed increase in a lot of fields, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if that fact itself would trigger demand for higher-quality translations. An MT generated translation is still far from flawless (sorry, colleagues who claim the opposite, but I'm afraid that says more about your translation and general language skills than about the quality of MT). ChatGPT does a little bit better, but only superficially by making things up to make your text sound better. This will eventually lead to a lot of quality problems, which might in turn promote better-quality translations.
| | | | | Imperfection | Oct 12, 2023 |
Lieven Malaise wrote:
ChatGPT does a little bit better, but only superficially by making things up to make your text sound better. This will eventually lead to a lot of quality problems, which might in turn promote better-quality translations.
As an example of how ChatGPT can fail, here is its response to a recent question of mine. I'd been reading about the recent Nobel Prize for physics, which was awarded to researchers working with pulses of light lasting attoseconds, and I wanted to get an idea of how long that was. So ...
Me: How far does light travel in an attosecond?
ChatGPT: In one attosecond (1 attosecond = 1 × 10^(-18) seconds), light can travel approximately 299,792.458 meters, which is approximately the speed of light in a vacuum. The speed of light in a vacuum is approximately 299,792,458 meters per second. Therefore, in one attosecond, light travels approximately 299,792.458 meters, or about 299.8 kilometers.
You don't have to be a Nobel prize-winning physicist to notice that, apart from getting the speed of light right, this is complete nonsense. Yet it's uttered with the same air of confidence and authority as all ChatGPT's responses (unless it's challenged, in which case it becomes pathetically apologetic).
[Edited to remove repetition]
[Edited at 2023-10-12 06:06 GMT]
| | | | dkfmmuc 
Local time: 02:28
Member (2009)
German to English
+ ...
| Proz.com and the industry at the crossroads | Oct 12, 2023 |
ibz wrote:
Dear site staff,
Please remove ChatGPT from KudoZ. It's useless, it's annoying and it doesn't make sense at all.
ProZ is supposed to be for professional translators. All answers from ChatGPT that I've seen so far are...
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I'm still waiting for an explanation as to why this feature was introduced at all. To proof that any term can be translated automatically, without taking the context into account?
This is a disgrace ...
Dear ibz,
thank you for your great contribution and bringing this questionable decision by the owners of proz.com to a broader audience. I think it was 3 or 4 years ago when I commented a similar decision pointing out that this service (of artificial neuronal networks) is completely overrated. It's communicated by a private owned company which stages a great meeting in Davos every years in order to ensure Big Tech the next markets to conquer.
In reality it is a huge database with a summary of decision rules and probabilities which words and terms to choose without any cultural background or the experience of a human translator involved.
Therefore I can simply say: It is honestly and open by the management and owner of proz.com to communicate openly which path to the unchartered territory they want to go. There are also training sessions offered regarding the use of "AI".
That said I really think about the future of the profession especially if you have a look of the short attention spans of the consumers. Which are requiring more and more texts in easy language.
Thank you for the wake up call.
And the decision is at proz.com either to represent and promote translation as a high quality service or more than a commodity. Sometimes communication of larger companies seem to derail completely with brand logos etc. changed very often and the easiest rules of high quality content not followed. Neither in the source or the localized version.
Best regards
Gerd
[Edited at 2023-10-12 08:22 GMT]
[Edited at 2023-10-12 08:24 GMT]
[Edited at 2023-10-12 08:52 GMT]
[Edited at 2023-10-12 08:53 GMT]
| | | | ibz
Local time: 02:28
Member (2007)
English to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Thank you, Gerd | Oct 12, 2023 |
Thank you for your encouraging words
Needless to say that I didn't get any response from ProZ, neither to my personal mails to Lucia (moderator) which is a disgrace in itself.
In view of this complete silence, my new suggestion would be to ignore all questions that are answered by ChatGTP. If the asker wants to use this very intelligent feature, let him/her do it, but why should we put any energy in searching fo... See more Thank you for your encouraging words
Needless to say that I didn't get any response from ProZ, neither to my personal mails to Lucia (moderator) which is a disgrace in itself.
In view of this complete silence, my new suggestion would be to ignore all questions that are answered by ChatGTP. If the asker wants to use this very intelligent feature, let him/her do it, but why should we put any energy in searching for the right solution in such cases? So people can get answers from ChatGTP in KudoZ, but no correction from human translators ... ▲ Collapse
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ibz
Local time: 02:28
Member (2007)
English to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Any answer on this thread or will it be closed as well? | Oct 19, 2023 |
I was just wondering if we could - finally - get some answers to the questions raised in this thread. My initinal post was supported by more than 60 persons and no questions were answered yet:
What about the truely appalling quality of ChatGPT's answers? (Also see the poll on this question)
How is this feature supposed to help professional translators?
Why is ChatGPT treated like a real member and who pays for it?
Why not investing time and energy in real improvements (fi... See more I was just wondering if we could - finally - get some answers to the questions raised in this thread. My initinal post was supported by more than 60 persons and no questions were answered yet:
What about the truely appalling quality of ChatGPT's answers? (Also see the poll on this question)
How is this feature supposed to help professional translators?
Why is ChatGPT treated like a real member and who pays for it?
Why not investing time and energy in real improvements (fixing bugs, banning bottom feeders from the site ...)?
I've been a paying member for a long time so it would be polite to get some reaction. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Zea_Mays
Italy
Local time: 02:28
Member (2009)
English to German
+ ...
| Add web design | Oct 19, 2023 |
ibz wrote:
Why not investing time and energy in real improvements (fixing bugs, banning bottom feeders from the site ...)?
I'd add better web design for desktops. The new design is very poor, as many already have confirmed.
Translators mainly work on desktops and may use mobile devices just for checking,
so having a proper adaptive version for PCs is important.
PS: I once asked Google's Bard (Chatty has no internet access) what it thinks about the Proz design. Well, the AI bot said it was not the best, to be diplomatic.
[Bearbeitet am 2023-10-19 10:34 GMT]
| | | | | Shall we have an event to discuss? | Oct 19, 2023 |
Hi all. I agree that it is juncture, of sorts, for those of us in the freelance language services part of the industry.
In a nutshell, our goal at ProZ is to help our members to use AI to their advantage. That's really the long and short of it! However, if anyone is dissatisfied with that as a response, and would like to delve more into ProZ intentions or plans, or -- probably more interestingly -- into how other translators are thinking about this topic right now, I would be happy ... See more Hi all. I agree that it is juncture, of sorts, for those of us in the freelance language services part of the industry.
In a nutshell, our goal at ProZ is to help our members to use AI to their advantage. That's really the long and short of it! However, if anyone is dissatisfied with that as a response, and would like to delve more into ProZ intentions or plans, or -- probably more interestingly -- into how other translators are thinking about this topic right now, I would be happy to have the team set up a virtual event of some sort.
If there is any interest, please feel free to suggest a title for the event. Thanks! ▲ Collapse
| | | | Jeff Whittaker
United States
Local time: 20:28
Spanish to English
+ ...
| I think this is a very bad decision | Oct 19, 2023 |
ProZ KudoZ are open to the public via a Google search. What the public will perceive is that there are professional translators who don't know how to translate stuff, so they have to get help from AI.
Not a good look. I just renewed my ProZ membership after years of being absent and I may decide not to renew because of this decision.
At the very least, make the AI (ChatGPT) suggestions invisible to non-registered users.
[Edited at 2023-10-19 20:22 GMT]
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Zea_Mays
Italy
Local time: 02:28
Member (2009)
English to German
+ ...
| @Henry: This thread is not about AI in general | Oct 19, 2023 |
Henry Dotterer wrote:
In a nutshell, our goal at ProZ is to help our members to use AI to their advantage. That's really the long and short of it!
This thread is about having ChatGPT in KudoZ.
It has been thoroughly discussed here why this is a bad idea. And it's far from being of some advantage for us.
I would also add that the bot's output here does not speak about its "intelligence". Visitors can have a good laugh reading its crap, though. But is it good marketing? I don't think so.
But this is no surprise. The bot needs to be controlled, so its use here is limited.
The output quality, the large number of disagrees and the comments on it should make one think. It's a failure story.
The main point, however, is a different one. It's the nature of KudoZ.
However, if anyone is dissatisfied with that as a response, and would like to delve more into ProZ intentions or plans, or -- probably more interestingly -- into how other translators are thinking about this topic right now, I would be happy to have the team set up a virtual event of some sort.
If there is any interest, please feel free to suggest a title for the event. Thanks!
On AI in general, yes. Could be very interesting.
| | | | Michele Fauble
United States
Local time: 17:28
Member (2006)
Norwegian to English
+ ...
| KudoZ rules and ChatGPT help | Oct 19, 2023 |
2.9
"Help" KudoZ should be used for requesting terms help after having searched the KudoZ term search and other resources.
https://www.proz.com/?sp=siterules&mode=show&category=kudoz_asking
I have no issue with translators using ChatGPT as a resource for researching terms, but like dictionaries, glossaries, internet research, etc., ... See more 2.9
"Help" KudoZ should be used for requesting terms help after having searched the KudoZ term search and other resources.
https://www.proz.com/?sp=siterules&mode=show&category=kudoz_asking
I have no issue with translators using ChatGPT as a resource for researching terms, but like dictionaries, glossaries, internet research, etc., this should be done before posting a KudoZ question.
“Michele Fauble has earned KudoZ points by translating tough terms for fellow translators.”
https://www2.proz.com/profile/84556?popup=kudoz
ChatGPT, as useful as it may be, is not a fellow translator. It is a resource like the above mentioned, and should be treated as such. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Thanks, Zea! | Oct 19, 2023 |
Zea_Mays wrote: Henry Dotterer wrote:
However, if anyone is dissatisfied with that as a response, and would like to delve more into ProZ intentions or plans, or -- probably more interestingly -- into how other translators are thinking about this topic right now, I would be happy to have the team set up a virtual event of some sort.
If there is any interest, please feel free to suggest a title for the event. Thanks!
On AI in general, yes. Could be very interesting.
Thanks, Zea! Anyone else interested? ibz? dkfmmuc? Michele? expressisverbis?
Suggest a title (so that I can be more sure that I understand your interest), and we'll do it...
| | | | | What did Bard say, Zea? | Oct 19, 2023 |
Zea_Mays wrote:
PS: I once asked Google's Bard (Chatty has no internet access) what it thinks about the Proz design. Well, the AI bot said it was not the best, to be diplomatic.
That's great! So you are using AI. What did Bard say? I see from the KudoZ thread that you have some sense in this area...
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ibz
Local time: 02:28
Member (2007)
English to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | @Henry: ChatGPT on KudoZ, not AI in general | Oct 19, 2023 |
As others said before, my suggestion specifically refers to ChatGPT on KudoZ, not to AI in general and neither to CAT tools.
It makes no sense, hurts our profession, makes up terms as well as explanations and - as far as I can see - comments on its quality are disastrous.
My question remains: Why introducing this feature? I truely don’t get it as it certainly doesn’t make my life as a translator easier.
Why not saying that this was a mistake? Doesn’t prevent anyone from u... See more As others said before, my suggestion specifically refers to ChatGPT on KudoZ, not to AI in general and neither to CAT tools.
It makes no sense, hurts our profession, makes up terms as well as explanations and - as far as I can see - comments on its quality are disastrous.
My question remains: Why introducing this feature? I truely don’t get it as it certainly doesn’t make my life as a translator easier.
Why not saying that this was a mistake? Doesn’t prevent anyone from using ChatGPT privately if s/he wants to… ▲ Collapse
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ibz wrote:
My question remains: Why introducing this feature?
Right, so I feel like we have answered that a few times here already... but you don't feel like you've gotten an answer... so maybe let's hop on a virtual event or a call of some sort and get this sorted out?
That's my invitation -- what do you say?
| | | | Zea_Mays
Italy
Local time: 02:28
Member (2009)
English to German
+ ...
| To the point | Oct 19, 2023 |
Michele Fauble wrote: 2.9 "Help" KudoZ should be used for requesting terms help after having searched the KudoZ term search and other resources. https://www.proz.com/?sp=siterules&mode=show&category=kudoz_asking I have no issue with translators using ChatGPT as a resource for researching terms, but like dictionaries, glossaries, internet research, etc., this should be done before posting a KudoZ question. “Michele Fauble has earned KudoZ points by translating tough terms for fellow translators.” https://www2.proz.com/profile/84556?popup=kudoz ChatGPT, as useful as it may be, is not a fellow translator. It is a resource like the above mentioned, and should be treated as such.
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